unions in the usa are not what they used to be. There are a lot of right to>k states and that just doesn't work with a union structure. people dont have
That is true, but they also do have some slave labor there. China is not at all nice to their minority groups. Look up Ughyrs (sp?) for some idea as to how they treat non-Han peoples.
if china does not like a specific ethnic group, they pull no punches.
but i've had experience with the hmong in wisconsin, and from my own personal perience, most of those people are just bad news.
similar in strength to those for Car Makers and such. I had some 'bad habits'.. I was spending a Lot of money building up a muscle car (575 HP Chevelle SS) and a custom Triumph Bonneville motorcycle so I needed as much income as possible. The best way to get called first for extra hours when someone didn't show up was to be a very hard worker.. Long story short, I was good enough that I earned a merit raise, the first one in the company in 15 years, for breaking company production records.. This earned me about 35% more money than others
in my situation, and led to me being cornered one night in a remote staircase and threatened by the local union rep. for making everyone else 'look bad'..
I told him to get stuffed but after that I had very little use for unions.
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so most companies take pretty good care to keep them happy because there are
In this case, it is also because they are Muslim and have not given up
their religion for the state.
but i've had experience with the hmong in wisconsin, and from my own personal perience, most of those people are just bad news.
Are the Hmong from China, or from SE Asia/Vietnam?
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so most companies take pretty good care to keep them happy because there are always other offers out there.
Re: How far I've come...
By: Cougar428 to TED LONG on Mon Jan 30 2023 03:42 pm
Most of the automotive PIC's and PLA's that used to be made in US silico ua and Beijing, right next to the Intel CPU plants.
Most of the RF and analog chips formerly made in the states by National from a nation led by one of the looniest dictators in the world. If Kim Jung older military tech gonna come from?
IMHO, the Chips Act is 20 years too late.
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unions in the usa are not what they used to be. There are a lot of right>k states and that just doesn't work with a union structure. people dont h
>join the union but they have to be protected by it. in this structure pe
>e held back due to the other union nuances, especially in pay. You can b
> in a job for 5 years before you make 2 dollars more.
My first long term job, part time while in school working at a grocery store taught me all I needed to know about unions. They have a union similar in strength to those for Car Makers and such. I had some 'bad habits'.. I was spending a Lot of money building up a muscle car (575 HP Chevelle SS) and a custom Triumph Bonneville motorcycle so I needed as much income as possible. The best way to get called first for extra hours when someone didn't show up was to be a very hard worker.. Long story short, I was good enough that I earned a merit raise, the first one in the company in 15 years, for breaking company production records.. This earned me about 35% more money than others in my situation, and led to me being cornered one night in a remote staircas and threatened by the local union rep. for making everyone else 'look bad'.. I told him to get stuffed but after that I had very little use for unions.
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so most companies take pretty good care to keep them happy because there are always other offers out there.
Re: How far I've come...
By: Rob Mccart to MRO on Mon Jan 30 2023 12:53 am
similar in strength to those for Car Makers and such. I had some 'bad habits'.. I was spending a Lot of money building up a muscle car (575 HP Chevelle SS) and a custom Triumph Bonneville motorcycle so I needed as mu income as possible. The best way to get called first for extra hours when someone didn't show up was to be a very hard worker.. Long story short, I was good enough that I earned a merit raise, the first one in the company 15 years, for breaking company production records.. This earned me about more money than others
in my situation, and led to me being cornered one night in a remote staircase and threatened by the local union rep. for making everyone else 'look bad'..
I told him to get stuffed but after that I had very little use for unions
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so most companies take pretty good care to keep them happy because there are
i dont know where unions are still required. we have osha, we have the depa ed to threaten to strike for every little thing. each time the contract was
i've been told not to sweep when i have nothing to do. i was told to drink a t hold people back now.
Re: How far I've come...
By: Dumas Walker to MRO on Mon Jan 30 2023 04:27 pm
In this case, it is also because they are Muslim and have not given up their religion for the state.
but i've had experience with the hmong in wisconsin, and from my own personal perience, most of those people are just bad news.
Are the Hmong from China, or from SE Asia/Vietnam?
i think the ones that fled here to the usa are from china.
internet sez "The Hmong people are an indigenous group in East and Southeas uch as Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, and Myanmar. "
they are basically a people with no country. the chinese hate them and use
In wisconsin theres's a lot on welfare and there's a lot of gangs where they
I've worked with some of them and they are very hard workers. they have very
The country also restricts travel from one province to another to regluate>jobs and commerce. This ia a way to keep farmers' families in farming, so
Yes, there's no question it's a lousy place to live. That's why so many wealthy Chinese move to the USA and Canada. Way too much government
control over everything there.. The only unusual thing there, being a communist country, is that they do seem to have a middle class. Usually
there is a tiny percentage of very rich people and the rest are all
super poor.
I think the ones who are loyal to the party can make a good living. That>is how it used to work in the USSR. Are the ones that "move" to Canada
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe> still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so
To put it in terms a Communist would understand, the power Unions hold comes>from maintaining the monopoly of workforce supply. If enough workers could
Admittedly, at one time, they were needed and in some places they maybe> still are, but I always found that hard workers are difficult to find so
I worked at a salaried job, then the plant shut down and relocated the repair>service department to the main plant. The main plant was a "closed shop"
At first we thought being unionized was repressive, but later on we saw how m>ch certain supervisiors would try to make up conflicting policies depending
No expert but I'd have to think that someone from China could immigrate here as easily as anyone else. It might take a while, as there are huge numbers of people that want to come to Canada (at least until they find out about the weather.. Ha!) but I'd assume many coming from China would be wealthy which probably helps the situation. But that's for a full time move. If they wanted to still return to their own country at times then they would probably be restricted to no more than 6 months at a time in Canada.^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It's a complex issue. Non-union places mainly only survive because they directly compete with Union places. If they pay less or have terrible working conditions, their workers will go elsewhere. Granted it's much better these days because of half decent minimum wages and safety conditions pretty much guaranteed by basic government rules.
he said that it's fairly nice there.. if you have money. But the average person there barely scrapes by. He mentioned the owner of a butcher shop that he bought from told him once, when complimented on the meat, that he tries to make it the best he can but couldn't comment much on it because
he couldn't afford to shop in his own store.
from other countries lived, and there was a high brick wall around the
whole area that was patrolled by hired soldiers with automatic weapons
24 hours a day.
That, and the fact that China is a communist country, might be where I got the idea that they could not immigrate permanently. I had heard that Chinese buy condos in BC and then rent them cheap during the seasons they are not there because they cannot stay. So I think that is where I got the idea that none of them could stay. Thanks!
Quoting Rob Mccart to Moondog <=-
Often management is a victim of the "Peter Principal.
There are a couple of definitions of that but the one I refer to is
that a person will rise in a company to just beyond the level of their competence, suggesting Most managers are incompetent at their jobs.
Not trying to be contentious, but instead of watching and talking
about the situation - is there something you would do differenty if
you were the one in charge?
In a lot of places, what I would see is people sitting on the
sidelines complaining about how the business was being managed, but
never really stepping up to try and change things in a better way.
>> here as easily as anyone else. If they wanted to still return toNo expert but I'd have to think that someone from China could immigrate
That, and the fact that China is a communist country, might be where I got>the idea that they could not immigrate permanently.
I had heard that Chinese buy condos in BC and then rent them cheap>during the seasons they are not there because they cannot stay.
> > directly compete with Union places. If they pay less or have terribleIt's a complex issue. Non-union places mainly only survive because they
are you talking about canada or other countries? i'm in the usa and i dont se>ny non union places only surviving because they directly compete with unions.
and regarding minimum wage, i only see that in non skilled jobs that>many adults wouldn't even take.
> > person there barely scrapes by. He mentioned the owner of a butcher shophe said that it's fairly nice there.. if you have money. But the average
oh i'm sure that's a cultural thing were he's acting humble. i'm sure he>has the pick of whatever he wants.
That, and the fact that China is a communist country, might be where I got>the idea that they could not immigrate permanently.
Well, think of all the people who have moved to Canada and the USA from Russia
or Cuba. I'd imagine most of them that want to move premanently are doing so because they don't like the system they are fleeing from and, even if that's not the case, they will likely have a big problem trying to convert us to their Commie ways.. B)
In a lot of cases it is wealthy people there looking for places to invest money they've managed to hide from their government where there's a good chance the places will go up in price. The limits on how long they can
stay would likely be based on if they want to immigrate permanently and
the hassle of the waiting period until they could get permission to move
here if they do. I expect the super rich in China have a better time of things than the average people there (think of Russian Oligarchs) and, although they may want to take advantage of things in the more 'free' countries, they may not have any desire to move here permanently, plus
they may have a major problem getting much more than a tiny percentage
of all their $Billions out of their home country..
that's not the case, they will likely have a big problem trying to convert us to their Commie ways.. B)
Cuba is another country I didn't think you were able to permanently leave without fleeing. I know that used to be true. If they are able to leave and are moving to Canada (and for the reasons we suspect), that is great!
>> here as easily as anyone else. If they wanted to still return toNo expert but I'd have to think that someone from China could immigrate
>> their own country at times then they would probably be restricted
>> to no more than 6 months at a time in Canada.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That, and the fact that China is a communist country, might be where I go>the idea that they could not immigrate permanently.
Well, think of all the people who have moved to Canada and the USA from Russ or Cuba. I'd imagine most of them that want to move premanently are doing so because they don't like the system they are fleeing from and, even if that's not the case, they will likely have a big problem trying to convert us to their Commie ways.. B)
I had heard that Chinese buy condos in BC and then rent them cheap>during the seasons they are not there because they cannot stay.
>So I think that is where I got the idea that none of them could stay.
In a lot of cases it is wealthy people there looking for places to invest money they've managed to hide from their government where there's a good chance the places will go up in price. The limits on how long they can
stay would likely be based on if they want to immigrate permanently and
the hassle of the waiting period until they could get permission to move here if they do. I expect the super rich in China have a better time of things than the average people there (think of Russian Oligarchs) and, although they may want to take advantage of things in the more 'free' countries, they may not have any desire to move here permanently, plus
they may have a major problem getting much more than a tiny percentage
of all their $Billions out of their home country..
Often management is a victim of the "Peter Principal.> There are a couple of definitions of that but the one I refer to is
Not trying to be contentious, but instead of watching and talking>about the situation - is there something you would do differenty if
In a lot of places, what I would see is people sitting on the>sidelines complaining about how the business was being managed, but
>> or Cuba. I'd imagine most of them that want to move premanently are doing sWell, think of all the people who have moved to Canada and the USA from Rus
Cuba is another country I didn't think you were able to permanently leave>without fleeing. I know that used to be true. If they are able to leave
Quoting Rob Mccart to Cougar428 <=-
Not trying to be contentious, but instead of watching and talking
about the situation - is there something you would do differenty if
you were the one in charge?
In a lot of places, what I would see is people sitting on the
sidelines complaining about how the business was being managed, but
never really stepping up to try and change things in a better way.
Have you ever tried to tell your boss that he's doing something wrong?
And the problem with incompetent bosses is they are paranoid about
losing their jobs so they will either ignore you, tell you to shut up,
or try to get rid of you in case higher-ups realize there is someone smarter than them available to do the job.
I say all that with a smile. I didn't intend for it to sound confrontatonal with you since I agree with your basic idea.
I told him to leave it to me and I'd find a way, and he did that
rather than trying to micro-manage how I did the work. I did manage it, basically doing about 8 or 10 hours of production in 5 hours.
In the end I stopped working for other people by the time I was 32. If
you are your own boss you only have to answer to the customers and, in most of the jobs I did, my customers actually paid me more than I asked for so that I would be readily available for them when they needed me again.
I told him to leave it to me and I'd find a way, and he did that> rather than trying to micro-manage how I did the work. I did manage it,
Sounds like you came through with the goods! That's great as long>as they don't expect you to do more with less as a rule of thumb.
I've gotten bitten by that dog a number of times. The boss sounds>like he trusted his people.
In the end I stopped working for other people by the time I was 32.>be.
Now there's the ticket! I wish I was as resourceful as you seem to
most of the jobs I did, my customers actually paid me more than I asked for so that I would be readily available for them when they needed me again.
Now there's the ticket! I wish I was as resourceful as you seem to
be. Thanks for the reply!
I told him to leave it to me and I'd find a way, and he did that> rather than trying to micro-manage how I did the work. I did manage it,
> basically doing about 8 or 10 hours of production in 5 hours.
Sounds like you came through with the goods! That's great as long>as they don't expect you to do more with less as a rule of thumb.
Yes, I think he was so amazed he decided not to question how I did it.
I definitely wouldn't want to do that too often, nor could a lot of people if I'm being honest. The speed up involved things like ignoring the
company policy of not lifting more than 70 lbs when dumping materials
into a large mixer we used. That day I was working with up to 175 lbs.
Sounds like you came through with the goods! That's great as long>as they don't expect you to do more with less as a rule of thumb.
Yes, I think he was so amazed he decided not to question how I did it.>I definitely wouldn't want to do that too often, nor could a lot of people
what type of job was this? was this manufacturing where you were not>showing up for the entire day and they accepted that?
most of the jobs I did, my customers actually paid me more than I asked> for so that I would be readily available for them when they needed me
Now there's the ticket! I wish I was as resourceful as you seem to be.>than what he asked for.
yeah he's really lucky. it's hard to believe that customers paid him more
Everything went back together, the fans are quieter, the fan that would stop working momentarily is working normally, and I didn't break
anything or have screws left over!
calcmandan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Everything went back together, the fans are quieter, the fan that would stop working momentarily is working normally, and I didn't break
anything or have screws left over!
I know the feeling, my old workhorse laptop from twelve years ago had
the same problem with the CPU fan. Then it happened to my firewall box. Then it happened to my cloud server. Then...
Feels good doesn't it.
calcmandan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Everything went back together, the fans are quieter, the fan that would stop working momentarily is working normally, and I didn't break anything or have screws left over!
I know the feeling, my old workhorse laptop from twelve years ago had the same problem with the CPU fan. Then it happened to my firewall box. Then it happened to my cloud server. Then...
Feels good doesn't it.
It feels good not tossing out old hardware; old hardware, with a little
bit of maintenance here and there seems to last longer.
more energy consumption. it's better to get rid of the old shit
and slim it all down.
Re: Re: How far I've come...
By: MRO to poindexter FORTRAN on Sun Feb 26 2023 06:46 pm
more energy consumption. it's better to get rid of the old shit
and slim it all down.
You'd be surprised sometimes.
If your computers work under medium to heavy load, there is a point past which it makes a lot of sense to ditch old hardware and replace it with new one. However, under lightweight load, it would take ages to save enough power to justify replacing an old computer worth 40 bucks for one worth 200.
Re: Re: How far I've come...
By: poindexter FORTRAN to calcmandan on Sun Feb 26 2023 07:56 am
calcmandan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Everything went back together, the fans are quieter, the fan that wo stop working momentarily is working normally, and I didn't break anything or have screws left over!
I know the feeling, my old workhorse laptop from twelve years ago ha the same problem with the CPU fan. Then it happened to my firewall b Then it happened to my cloud server. Then...
Feels good doesn't it.
It feels good not tossing out old hardware; old hardware, with a little bit of maintenance here and there seems to last longer.
more energy consumption. it's better to get rid of the old shit
and slim it all down.
Re: How far I've come...
By: MRO to Dumas Walker on Thu Jan 26 2023 08:47 pm
I don't think we're at the point where china makes cheap junk.
Pretty much this.
China used to be the laughting stock of the world, selling cheap junk which was
good for barely anything. They aren't anymore.
So many foreigner countries helped the Chinesse build their industry to produce
merchandise up to European and American standards that at some point they realized they could use that infrastructure and experience to produce it themselves. If an European clock manufacturer funds a clock factory in china, and sends an European foreman to oversee the production of watches, you will find that factory produces watches under a Chinesse brand when the foreman is not looking, using European standards and the toolchains the Europeans bought for them. It happens in Morocco all the time too.
A contruction engineer I know used to warn us in the early 2010s. "Chinesse construction steel is no longer total junk. They are starting to show up with quality stuff."
--Japan was like that in the 60-70's. Cheap copies everywhere, and in the 80's they managed to surpass the West in a lot of places.
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
---
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On 2023-01-28, Arelor <PALANT!Arelor@vert.synchro.net> wrote:
Re: How far I've come...
By: MRO to Dumas Walker on Thu Jan 26 2023 08:47 pm
I don't think we're at the point where china makes cheap junk.
Pretty much this.
China used to be the laughting stock of the world, selling cheap junk whic good for barely anything. They aren't anymore.
So many foreigner countries helped the Chinesse build their industry to pr merchandise up to European and American standards that at some point they realized they could use that infrastructure and experience to produce it themselves. If an European clock manufacturer funds a clock factory in chi and sends an European foreman to oversee the production of watches, you wi find that factory produces watches under a Chinesse brand when the foreman not looking, using European standards and the toolchains the Europeans bou for them. It happens in Morocco all the time too.
A contruction engineer I know used to warn us in the early 2010s. "Chiness construction steel is no longer total junk. They are starting to show up w quality stuff."
--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken
---Japan was like that in the 60-70's. Cheap copies everywhere, and in the 80's they managed to surpass the West in a lot of places.
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